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	<title>Comments on: Test Sail On A Boreal 44</title>
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		<title>By: Interesting Sailboats - Page 97 - SailNet Community</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-4539</link>
		<dc:creator>Interesting Sailboats - Page 97 - SailNet Community</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 16:00:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Colin Speedie</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-331</link>
		<dc:creator>Colin Speedie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jun 2010 17:57:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-331</guid>
		<description>Tom, thanks for that. I had no idea that Garcia had been taken over. Our original idea had been to buy a hull and deck from Garcia (Passoa 43) to finish ourselves, but the price we were quoted was so extraordinary, we soon dropped that idea! The new boats do seem to have moved away from the original ethos, so maybe the change of ownership explains things a little.

Victor, it took me 20 years to decide on the boat I wanted, picking people&#039;s brains and playing the magpie around boatyards, as well as coming up with a few ideas myself. And at the end of the day, I still got things wrong, and then there were simply things that weren&#039;t options available with our OVNI. So, you&#039;re right, things are always a compromise, and there will always be things you will kick yourself for having neglected to specify.

So I&#039;m working up my thoughts on what we would have done differently, were we at the same stage once again - watch out for it soon.

And thanks to everybody who has contributed so many interesting and pertinent comments throughout this series - which has made it all the more worthwhile for all of us.

Best wishes
Colin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, thanks for that. I had no idea that Garcia had been taken over. Our original idea had been to buy a hull and deck from Garcia (Passoa 43) to finish ourselves, but the price we were quoted was so extraordinary, we soon dropped that idea! The new boats do seem to have moved away from the original ethos, so maybe the change of ownership explains things a little.</p>
<p>Victor, it took me 20 years to decide on the boat I wanted, picking people&#8217;s brains and playing the magpie around boatyards, as well as coming up with a few ideas myself. And at the end of the day, I still got things wrong, and then there were simply things that weren&#8217;t options available with our OVNI. So, you&#8217;re right, things are always a compromise, and there will always be things you will kick yourself for having neglected to specify.</p>
<p>So I&#8217;m working up my thoughts on what we would have done differently, were we at the same stage once again &#8211; watch out for it soon.</p>
<p>And thanks to everybody who has contributed so many interesting and pertinent comments throughout this series &#8211; which has made it all the more worthwhile for all of us.</p>
<p>Best wishes<br />
Colin</p>
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		<title>By: Victor Raymond</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-330</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor Raymond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 22:26:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-330</guid>
		<description>Tom,
thanks for the information re: Garcia. I had a feeling things had changed there.

Colin, I never had any doubt the french aluminum centerboarders are up to the task. I am interested to hear what you would change on your Ovni when you have the chance to put it down. I, for one, have not found a single boat that has all the things I feel are important. There are compromises everywhere. I think the Boreal comes closest to my idea of a production expedition boat.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom,<br />
thanks for the information re: Garcia. I had a feeling things had changed there.</p>
<p>Colin, I never had any doubt the french aluminum centerboarders are up to the task. I am interested to hear what you would change on your Ovni when you have the chance to put it down. I, for one, have not found a single boat that has all the things I feel are important. There are compromises everywhere. I think the Boreal comes closest to my idea of a production expedition boat.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-329</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Jun 2010 13:44:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-329</guid>
		<description>To Victor,
From my information, Garcia has been sold by the initial creators of the brand some years ago...The new owners started the range &#039;Salt&#039;. There are mixed echos about those boats. Lately things did not go very well and the yard was saved in extremis from bankruptcy. It&#039;s now Allures who owns the brand.

Regards Tom ( Holland)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Victor,<br />
From my information, Garcia has been sold by the initial creators of the brand some years ago&#8230;The new owners started the range &#8216;Salt&#8217;. There are mixed echos about those boats. Lately things did not go very well and the yard was saved in extremis from bankruptcy. It&#8217;s now Allures who owns the brand.</p>
<p>Regards Tom ( Holland)</p>
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		<title>By: Colin Speedie</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-328</link>
		<dc:creator>Colin Speedie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 17:23:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-328</guid>
		<description>Hi Victor

There are those who suggest that centreboarders are not suitable for high latitude travel, but as Jean-Francois has pointed out the track record of boats from OVNI and Garcia would suggest otherwise. What I think the Boreal does very well is to identify suitable features you would want for such sailing from the design stage, whereas you might have to upspec one of the others from the start. And I saw nothing about the Boreal that would have made it unsuitable for the tropics, either.

Best wishes

Colin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Victor</p>
<p>There are those who suggest that centreboarders are not suitable for high latitude travel, but as Jean-Francois has pointed out the track record of boats from OVNI and Garcia would suggest otherwise. What I think the Boreal does very well is to identify suitable features you would want for such sailing from the design stage, whereas you might have to upspec one of the others from the start. And I saw nothing about the Boreal that would have made it unsuitable for the tropics, either.</p>
<p>Best wishes</p>
<p>Colin</p>
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		<title>By: Jean-François Eeman</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-327</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean-François Eeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 05:46:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-327</guid>
		<description>Carter,
Yes, the casings for the daggerboards and the rudder post are behind the bulkhead.

Victor,
We would be happy to build a boat for you! And the dollar rate is in your favour. Once we have agreed on a precise configuration it would take us 18 month to launch your boat.

Many thanks to all who in one way or another contributed to the success of this overview.

Jean-François</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carter,<br />
Yes, the casings for the daggerboards and the rudder post are behind the bulkhead.</p>
<p>Victor,<br />
We would be happy to build a boat for you! And the dollar rate is in your favour. Once we have agreed on a precise configuration it would take us 18 month to launch your boat.</p>
<p>Many thanks to all who in one way or another contributed to the success of this overview.</p>
<p>Jean-François</p>
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		<title>By: Victor Raymond</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-326</link>
		<dc:creator>Victor Raymond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 16:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-326</guid>
		<description>John/Colin/Jean-Francois
A big thank you to all three of you for hosting, reviewing and all the good comments. My last question of course is how soon can I get one?

Thanks again

Victor</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John/Colin/Jean-Francois<br />
A big thank you to all three of you for hosting, reviewing and all the good comments. My last question of course is how soon can I get one?</p>
<p>Thanks again</p>
<p>Victor</p>
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		<title>By: Carter</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-325</link>
		<dc:creator>Carter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 16:26:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-325</guid>
		<description>Jean-Francios
Thanks for your clear and concise explanations. The YouTube video does show a very well behaved boat with a relaxed helmsman and crew in obviously quite strong winds. One more question. Are the daggerboards and rudder post behind the aft waterproof bulkhead?

Colin
Thanks for going to all the trouble to write this review. I also appreciated that your opinion was based on personal observation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jean-Francios<br />
Thanks for your clear and concise explanations. The YouTube video does show a very well behaved boat with a relaxed helmsman and crew in obviously quite strong winds. One more question. Are the daggerboards and rudder post behind the aft waterproof bulkhead?</p>
<p>Colin<br />
Thanks for going to all the trouble to write this review. I also appreciated that your opinion was based on personal observation.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-324</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 12:14:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-324</guid>
		<description>A very big thank you to Colin for a really excellent review. I wonder, if the Boreal 47 had existed before we commenced what turned out to be a three year refit on Morgan’s Cloud, what we would have done…

Also, a special thank you to Jean-François(s) for their very open attitude, even when their brain child was criticized, and the clear way in which they have answered all of our questions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A very big thank you to Colin for a really excellent review. I wonder, if the Boreal 47 had existed before we commenced what turned out to be a three year refit on Morgan’s Cloud, what we would have done…</p>
<p>Also, a special thank you to Jean-François(s) for their very open attitude, even when their brain child was criticized, and the clear way in which they have answered all of our questions.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Jean-François Eeman</title>
		<link>http://www.morganscloud.com/2010/06/12/boreal-44-test-sail/comment-page-1/#comment-323</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean-François Eeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 11:52:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.morganscloud.com/whatisnew/?p=349#comment-323</guid>
		<description>Thank you very much for all those comments... There is very much to say and I&#039;ll try to be as complete and factual as possible.

Victor and Colin,

There is a topping lift, which is the same size as the halyard so it can be used as a second halyard. With the rigid boom vang it is not really essential so I remove it from the end of the boom to avoid it ragging unnecessarily along the main...

Heater : You can combine the advantages of both systems using the same circuit of pipes and radiators. I don&#039;t know for other brands but Eberspächer does it...

Interior : Have a look at my previous comments and you&#039;ll see we propose a version as Victor suggests.

Traveler:  The &quot;window&quot; of angles in which a traveler on the doghouse would be effective is very narrow...Our webbing system with blocks at different places on the beam compensates for the lack of a traveler...Moreover on boats which are not racing boats, the delta in performances and angles which cannot be compensated by the use of your vang are - according to us- really not very significant.

Victor,
There are examples of Ovni&#039;s and Garcia&#039;s who went everywhere around the globe!  I even spent a lot of time with a Swiss family who went to Antarctica and back in very nasty conditions with an Ovni 345. Just like Ovni, Garcia has had new owners. It is important to see what the approach of the new owners are for the future.

Richard,
I do agree with you that when you read about a boat, what we really want to know is her seaworthiness. At the same time, I really do appreciate the fact that Colin only wrote about things he was able to see or experiment... That is an objective approach.
I will try to be as objective and factual as he is, not &quot;praising&quot; qualities which obviously need a reality check.

Speaking about reality checks :
Last Autumn, Belgian journalists traveled to Brittany to test the boat in storm conditions. As they went out, the real wind was peaking at 54 knots... They felt totally safe and were enthusiastic... Article can be seen (but maybe not so easily understand) on our site www.voiliers-boreal.com (press review- article in dutch from Varen). The movie is/was on You Tube. I&#039;ll try to see where...
Anyhow: according to them it was the first time ever a yard accepted to have their boat tested in those conditions. (In the same spirit last spring, we accepted two journalists of Voiliers &amp; Voiliers to be on board for the first sail ever with the Boréal 44... )

At Boréal the managing partners, the two Jean-François, were sailors before being boatbuilders. We met in Ushuaia where we both lived for two years on board our boats. Jean-François Delvoye designed the very first Boréal 50 to take his family and himself to places he could/dare not to go with his previous boat... So initially, not for commercial purposes.

I&#039;ll be happy to answer any remarks you might have on the subject.

Jean-François</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you very much for all those comments&#8230; There is very much to say and I&#8217;ll try to be as complete and factual as possible.</p>
<p>Victor and Colin,</p>
<p>There is a topping lift, which is the same size as the halyard so it can be used as a second halyard. With the rigid boom vang it is not really essential so I remove it from the end of the boom to avoid it ragging unnecessarily along the main&#8230;</p>
<p>Heater : You can combine the advantages of both systems using the same circuit of pipes and radiators. I don&#8217;t know for other brands but Eberspächer does it&#8230;</p>
<p>Interior : Have a look at my previous comments and you&#8217;ll see we propose a version as Victor suggests.</p>
<p>Traveler:  The &#8220;window&#8221; of angles in which a traveler on the doghouse would be effective is very narrow&#8230;Our webbing system with blocks at different places on the beam compensates for the lack of a traveler&#8230;Moreover on boats which are not racing boats, the delta in performances and angles which cannot be compensated by the use of your vang are &#8211; according to us- really not very significant.</p>
<p>Victor,<br />
There are examples of Ovni&#8217;s and Garcia&#8217;s who went everywhere around the globe!  I even spent a lot of time with a Swiss family who went to Antarctica and back in very nasty conditions with an Ovni 345. Just like Ovni, Garcia has had new owners. It is important to see what the approach of the new owners are for the future.</p>
<p>Richard,<br />
I do agree with you that when you read about a boat, what we really want to know is her seaworthiness. At the same time, I really do appreciate the fact that Colin only wrote about things he was able to see or experiment&#8230; That is an objective approach.<br />
I will try to be as objective and factual as he is, not &#8220;praising&#8221; qualities which obviously need a reality check.</p>
<p>Speaking about reality checks :<br />
Last Autumn, Belgian journalists traveled to Brittany to test the boat in storm conditions. As they went out, the real wind was peaking at 54 knots&#8230; They felt totally safe and were enthusiastic&#8230; Article can be seen (but maybe not so easily understand) on our site <a href="http://www.voiliers-boreal.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.voiliers-boreal.com</a> (press review- article in dutch from Varen). The movie is/was on You Tube. I&#8217;ll try to see where&#8230;<br />
Anyhow: according to them it was the first time ever a yard accepted to have their boat tested in those conditions. (In the same spirit last spring, we accepted two journalists of Voiliers &amp; Voiliers to be on board for the first sail ever with the Boréal 44&#8230; )</p>
<p>At Boréal the managing partners, the two Jean-François, were sailors before being boatbuilders. We met in Ushuaia where we both lived for two years on board our boats. Jean-François Delvoye designed the very first Boréal 50 to take his family and himself to places he could/dare not to go with his previous boat&#8230; So initially, not for commercial purposes.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll be happy to answer any remarks you might have on the subject.</p>
<p>Jean-François</p>
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